Do you have examples of who might qualify? Do you think there are any female equivalents to those categories? I wonder if the "model face" that women came up with in a different article might be analogous to "powerful," kind of like Cersei.
Where to begin? I LOVED this. And if I may, I have a few suggestions:
Gorgeous: Alain Delon (La Piscine), Jude Law (The Holiday), Austin Butler (Elvis). Men who, in their prime, are just jaw-droppingly attractive. I might add the real Elvis, circa 1955.
Handsome: Denzel Washington (The Pelican Brief), Clark Gable (Gone With the Wind), Jon Hamm (Mad Men), Cary Grant (Notorious), Harry Belafonte. Classic good looks no matter the era.
Hot: Marlon Brando (On The Waterfront), Jean-Paul Belmondo (Breathless), Humphrey Bogart (Casablanca). Bogart is an especially good example of hotness having little to do with good looks.
Cute: Leonardo Di Caprio in Titanic owns this category!
You totally read my mind on some of these! I had to narrow it down because I wanted the same number of guys in each category and it was getting lopsided, but Jude Law WAS in the Gorgeous category, and Denzel was also in Handsome!
I think Jude Law is singularly and almost inarguably the most facially gorgeous man that ever existed, when he was in his 20s/30s. It's almost a crime (though I suppose I respect it) that he has allowed himself to go bald, when men don't have to go bald these days if they don't want to. Good choices here. Except Leo DiCaprio who I always thought looked like a chubby spoiled little rotten boy and it was bizarre to me when women swooned over Titanic bc he looked about 13 in that movie 😂
I was about to say.... I didn't agree with the guys in her 'gorgeous' category and immediately thought of Alain Delon, Jude Law, and Elvis. I would also add Henry Cavill. Tom Welling when he was young. These are men who are so beautiful they nearly defy humanity.
Phenomenal stuff - the third category is the most interesting as its logic and criteria seems to diverge the most from the female equivalent. I reckon there are two categories in this zone that are easily conflated for sexually-dimorphism reasons.
Hot A) Fit. Dimorphically manifests as a musculoskeletal phenomenon in men and a soft tissue plus health-bounty thing in women, with some common factors like good hair quality.
Hot B) Seductive/Charming. Dimorphically manifests as assertive manner, grooming, style and attire in men and an impelling e-hither in women, rooted in mesmerising and arresting qualities.
Yes, "Hot" could definitely be broken down into two factors like that. Totally makes sense. I think the sex appeal included in "hotness" is the part that's parallel to the women's category, but I feel like each could use at least one more category. There were some attractive guys that just didn't fit any bucketn properly.
The "hot" category in men seems to me to contain at least a hint of danger, corresponding to the "femme fatale" archetype for women. Brando, Bogart and Belmondo often played bad guys. This helps to explain the otherwise mysterious Tony Soprano thing, also what Luigi is doing in this essay in the first place!
Astute, I’d file that under the Seductive/Charming/Alluring category.
Another detail I’ll note here in general is that one can flesh out the natural antipodes of unnattractiveness / ugliness for each category, and also the limitations of each of used as a sole point of attraction. For instance, just coming as dangerous/edgy with no other traits is a turn off, and so it just being “cute” in a weak, assymetrical blob kinda way.
I'm not saying he does anything wrong, but he strikes me like an approachably Latin potato, and it's kind of uncanny when the cinematography is presenting him as hot. I guess, I get the idea of positive masculinity since he comes across like a guidance counselor who used to drive a truck or a forklift for a living-- just odd for that to evidently be such a skirt dropper.
I mostly write it off as severe DILF lust. I like him but I kinda wish I saw him in less (or at least different) stuff because I find him about as intimidating as wool socks straight out of the dryer.
I'm with you there. I didn't even really see the "nontoxic" part, myself, but maybe I wasn't paying close enough attention to that show and I don't know nearly enough about the man's personal life to use that. I can't remember anything else I've even seen him in. I feel like the cultural moment we were in forced a few otherwise forgettable-looking man faces into our collective consciousness and told us we must find them attractive or we, too, might be as toxic as the guys we actually thought were hot, lol. I suspect Timothee Chalamet might also belong in this category which, looking back, should've been its own. I could have added Tony Soprano to it because he is also Not Attractive despite psyops trying to convince us otherwise.
I became aware of him as an actor from the Mandalorian, where you barely see him. That sort of made me realize how I'd seen him around before; I think the big role that made people think of him as a sex symbol was Oberyn Martell from GoT. And I had not really absorbed him from that role-- like I was like "Oh yeah, he was that guy" after the fact. And it's funny because, yes, even in that famously "hot guy" role I kind of missed the Pedro is Sexy bus. Fun character but I didn't fall in love or anything.
The Tony Soprano one was weird, right!? Weird enough for me to take it as bait, although gosh knows there's a fangirl for everybody. I was all "Women don't love Tony Soprano; Men love Tony Soprano. Women maybe don't hate Tony Soprano, and some minority of women probably love him, which gives schlubby guys a lot of hope..."
I don't think the list needs much tweaking. I think you're largely spot on and agree with the whole thing. Maybe the major categories could use some subcategories or subtypes-- but with women, especially, I think there's a more important (for men) layer under the way guys are attractive, to categories of ways guys are attractive enough. I don't see this as the "wouldn't kick him out of bed for eating crackers" list but the go the extra mile list--the guys that get more than just "Yes" from women and get closer to "Please" from women. Like if you're a 6.5/10 guy... are you a "Gorgeous?" type 6.5/10? Is that the flavor of how you got that 1.5 more than 5/10? Could be!
"I don't see this as the "wouldn't kick him out of bed for eating crackers" list but the go the extra mile list--the guys that get more than just "Yes" from women and get closer to "Please" from women. Like if you're a 6.5/10 guy... are you a "Gorgeous?" type 6.5/10? Is that the flavor of how you got that 1.5 more than 5/10? Could be!"
I know what you mean! The thing about that particular list is that I'm not sure it could be made without invoking some personality traits or other characteristics that help bring him over the top. Because while I think that there are some guys whose appearance alone might put them in the "please" category over the "wouldn't kick him out of bed" category, I think that there are certain quirks that are included in what puts him over the top that only make themselves apparent once you actually talk to him or see him move or, like, interact with the world around him.
I was trying to think of who I might put in that category, and my immediate thought was Huntley from my Hot category, but even with him, I first became aware of him through YouTube clips from his performances on The Voice, so I can't really separate that from photos of him because I already know how he sings and talks and moves, which definitely inform my opinion of him. For this reason, too, this list would be hard to create in a more universally-relatable way because none of us really know the people we'd all recognize beyond their various performances or art. Then again, that may be enough!
I'm actively working this out right here in this comment, lol.
I think one of the first steps humans take after "That person is attractive!" Is trying to find the personality that the attraction is conveying. I think even dumb, young thirsty dudes pull this with thing like "big tiddy goth gf" meming. Yeah they're shallow but they still have like weird tells that they have hopes for their partner and want guidance in courting styles. People want another person, not just a high genetic dice roll.
We want those extra details before we make hard calls on attraction.
What?? A potato?? He has lots of interesting angles to his face, he's not potato like at all. He basically looks like a Roman statue, except one that got punched in the nose so it's a little smashed. But also he's hot because he appears to be very tall...which is weird bc I guess he isn't, but he looks like he is. And he always plays roles that are simultaneously tough warrior guys but also very protective and passionate and not afraid of his feminine side. Like every single role he plays he's a killer who spends his life adoring and protecting women and children and standing up for them against asshole men. Of course women love him. If he'd played different roles, maybe not so much.
It's funny that he looks tall but isn't, because I thought the opposite about James Gandolfini when I watched The Sopranos. He looked so much shorter than he really was. I wonder what does that
Good question! I would really like to know the answer. Maybe it's like head size in proportion to body? Or something about limb length? Bc Gandolfini has a giant head. I assumed Pedro was like 6'4" but I just looked it up and he's 5'11". Which isn't short obviously, and probably is quite tall for an actor, but on screen he comes off as towering over everyone and very tall.
I guess it's natural to take potato to mean rounded and blobby; they are. I mostly mean bland in a way that's warming and yummy. Non-threatening and non-descript in a good way. We're talking looks so I shouldn't invoke meals. .. Pedro's always looked a bit basset houndy to me so I can't help but invoke droop though, so I'm sure that's part of it.
Funny he looks very average in height to me. But averageness is like his impact on me hard. He looks like a super nice guy though, but broey not swishy. I chalk it to DILF thirst for a reason because he does look like he was born with kids and advice on how to fix a lawn-mower.
This is totally bizarre I cAnnot understand this. And he doesn't have any children even though he's about to be 50. 😂 The only way that I can think this makes any sense at all is because you associate him with the Mandalorian, which was basically a kid's show?? But he was in a mask the whole thing so that doesn't make sense. I don't see any lawnmower fixing or dad energy at all, I see swashbuckling latin lover/protector. To me he's like updated Antonio Banderas. But I guess I associate him much more strongly with Oberyn Martell.
Also, you're too tall to have opinions on height. 😊 Once you hit 6'3" you guys just think everyone is short unless they're like basketball players.
I'm not saying he does anything wrong, but he strikes me like an approachably Latin potato, and it's kind of uncanny when the cinematography is presenting him as hot. I guess, I get the idea of positive masculinity since he comes across like a guidance counselor who used to drive a truck or a forklift for a living-- just odd for that to evidently be such a skirt dropper.
I mostly write it off as severe DILF lust. I like him but I kinda wish I saw him in less (or at least different) stuff because I find him about as intimidating as wool socks straight out of the dryer.
I have always perceived another category, not represented here, which I would describe as Beautiful. Dennis Hopper, Terence Stamp, Eric Roberts, Cillian Murphy. Sometimes brutish (autocorrected to British, haha) and superficially ugly, but with delicate facial features: eyes, eyebrows, lips. Almost androgynous, as though the zygote could have gone either way and produced a stunning specimen of either sex. The corresponding female category is Handsome, e.g. Anjelica Huston, Angela Bassett, Michelle Yeoh.
Omg I can’t believe my man appeared in each one!!
He defies categorization.
Ok but what about "charismatic" and "powerful"
Do you have examples of who might qualify? Do you think there are any female equivalents to those categories? I wonder if the "model face" that women came up with in a different article might be analogous to "powerful," kind of like Cersei.
Where to begin? I LOVED this. And if I may, I have a few suggestions:
Gorgeous: Alain Delon (La Piscine), Jude Law (The Holiday), Austin Butler (Elvis). Men who, in their prime, are just jaw-droppingly attractive. I might add the real Elvis, circa 1955.
Handsome: Denzel Washington (The Pelican Brief), Clark Gable (Gone With the Wind), Jon Hamm (Mad Men), Cary Grant (Notorious), Harry Belafonte. Classic good looks no matter the era.
Hot: Marlon Brando (On The Waterfront), Jean-Paul Belmondo (Breathless), Humphrey Bogart (Casablanca). Bogart is an especially good example of hotness having little to do with good looks.
Cute: Leonardo Di Caprio in Titanic owns this category!
You totally read my mind on some of these! I had to narrow it down because I wanted the same number of guys in each category and it was getting lopsided, but Jude Law WAS in the Gorgeous category, and Denzel was also in Handsome!
Totally agree about Leo Dicaprio, too.
Yes, to Marlon Brando, but only once the 90s rolled around.
Brando was way hotter in streetcar than waterfront, and I’d add James Dean
His eye roll always gets me.
I think Jude Law is singularly and almost inarguably the most facially gorgeous man that ever existed, when he was in his 20s/30s. It's almost a crime (though I suppose I respect it) that he has allowed himself to go bald, when men don't have to go bald these days if they don't want to. Good choices here. Except Leo DiCaprio who I always thought looked like a chubby spoiled little rotten boy and it was bizarre to me when women swooned over Titanic bc he looked about 13 in that movie 😂
Exactly! The Cute guy is eternally boyish. Teenage girls adore that look!
Y'all are shallow as fuck 😂
I was about to say.... I didn't agree with the guys in her 'gorgeous' category and immediately thought of Alain Delon, Jude Law, and Elvis. I would also add Henry Cavill. Tom Welling when he was young. These are men who are so beautiful they nearly defy humanity.
Luigi in every category
😎🥵
I’m “cute” at best
If I remember a picture you posted awhile back correctly, I'd put you in the Hot category.
I’m a homeless shelter 10!
Hell yeah, gotta start somewhere
In Scottsdale, AZ I’m a 6. In Spokane, WA I’m an 8+!
I see what you did there
What are your thoughts on Luigi? lol
Which category does Sauron, lord of darkness fall into? https://heroes-and-villain.fandom.com/wiki/Sauron_(Middle-earth)
My man's got some intense eyes. We'll stick him in Gorgeous.
Phenomenal stuff - the third category is the most interesting as its logic and criteria seems to diverge the most from the female equivalent. I reckon there are two categories in this zone that are easily conflated for sexually-dimorphism reasons.
Hot A) Fit. Dimorphically manifests as a musculoskeletal phenomenon in men and a soft tissue plus health-bounty thing in women, with some common factors like good hair quality.
Hot B) Seductive/Charming. Dimorphically manifests as assertive manner, grooming, style and attire in men and an impelling e-hither in women, rooted in mesmerising and arresting qualities.
Yes, "Hot" could definitely be broken down into two factors like that. Totally makes sense. I think the sex appeal included in "hotness" is the part that's parallel to the women's category, but I feel like each could use at least one more category. There were some attractive guys that just didn't fit any bucketn properly.
The "hot" category in men seems to me to contain at least a hint of danger, corresponding to the "femme fatale" archetype for women. Brando, Bogart and Belmondo often played bad guys. This helps to explain the otherwise mysterious Tony Soprano thing, also what Luigi is doing in this essay in the first place!
Astute, I’d file that under the Seductive/Charming/Alluring category.
Another detail I’ll note here in general is that one can flesh out the natural antipodes of unnattractiveness / ugliness for each category, and also the limitations of each of used as a sole point of attraction. For instance, just coming as dangerous/edgy with no other traits is a turn off, and so it just being “cute” in a weak, assymetrical blob kinda way.
If I'm anywhere here it's somewhere between cute and hot.
If you want to look more deeply in all things female beauty in exhausting detail, I'd recommend the comprehensive work of the evil vizier J. Sanilac.
https://www.jsanilac.com/dispelling-beauty-lies/?ref=jsanilac.com
He did not find much about male physical attractiveness, that mattered more than height, upper body strength and penis size, though.
That looks interesting, thanks for sharing!
I never get Pedro Pascal thirst myself.
I'm not saying he does anything wrong, but he strikes me like an approachably Latin potato, and it's kind of uncanny when the cinematography is presenting him as hot. I guess, I get the idea of positive masculinity since he comes across like a guidance counselor who used to drive a truck or a forklift for a living-- just odd for that to evidently be such a skirt dropper.
I mostly write it off as severe DILF lust. I like him but I kinda wish I saw him in less (or at least different) stuff because I find him about as intimidating as wool socks straight out of the dryer.
I'm with you there. I didn't even really see the "nontoxic" part, myself, but maybe I wasn't paying close enough attention to that show and I don't know nearly enough about the man's personal life to use that. I can't remember anything else I've even seen him in. I feel like the cultural moment we were in forced a few otherwise forgettable-looking man faces into our collective consciousness and told us we must find them attractive or we, too, might be as toxic as the guys we actually thought were hot, lol. I suspect Timothee Chalamet might also belong in this category which, looking back, should've been its own. I could have added Tony Soprano to it because he is also Not Attractive despite psyops trying to convince us otherwise.
I became aware of him as an actor from the Mandalorian, where you barely see him. That sort of made me realize how I'd seen him around before; I think the big role that made people think of him as a sex symbol was Oberyn Martell from GoT. And I had not really absorbed him from that role-- like I was like "Oh yeah, he was that guy" after the fact. And it's funny because, yes, even in that famously "hot guy" role I kind of missed the Pedro is Sexy bus. Fun character but I didn't fall in love or anything.
The Tony Soprano one was weird, right!? Weird enough for me to take it as bait, although gosh knows there's a fangirl for everybody. I was all "Women don't love Tony Soprano; Men love Tony Soprano. Women maybe don't hate Tony Soprano, and some minority of women probably love him, which gives schlubby guys a lot of hope..."
I don't think the list needs much tweaking. I think you're largely spot on and agree with the whole thing. Maybe the major categories could use some subcategories or subtypes-- but with women, especially, I think there's a more important (for men) layer under the way guys are attractive, to categories of ways guys are attractive enough. I don't see this as the "wouldn't kick him out of bed for eating crackers" list but the go the extra mile list--the guys that get more than just "Yes" from women and get closer to "Please" from women. Like if you're a 6.5/10 guy... are you a "Gorgeous?" type 6.5/10? Is that the flavor of how you got that 1.5 more than 5/10? Could be!
"I don't see this as the "wouldn't kick him out of bed for eating crackers" list but the go the extra mile list--the guys that get more than just "Yes" from women and get closer to "Please" from women. Like if you're a 6.5/10 guy... are you a "Gorgeous?" type 6.5/10? Is that the flavor of how you got that 1.5 more than 5/10? Could be!"
I know what you mean! The thing about that particular list is that I'm not sure it could be made without invoking some personality traits or other characteristics that help bring him over the top. Because while I think that there are some guys whose appearance alone might put them in the "please" category over the "wouldn't kick him out of bed" category, I think that there are certain quirks that are included in what puts him over the top that only make themselves apparent once you actually talk to him or see him move or, like, interact with the world around him.
I was trying to think of who I might put in that category, and my immediate thought was Huntley from my Hot category, but even with him, I first became aware of him through YouTube clips from his performances on The Voice, so I can't really separate that from photos of him because I already know how he sings and talks and moves, which definitely inform my opinion of him. For this reason, too, this list would be hard to create in a more universally-relatable way because none of us really know the people we'd all recognize beyond their various performances or art. Then again, that may be enough!
I'm actively working this out right here in this comment, lol.
Heh, it's a complicated subject so I fell you.
I think one of the first steps humans take after "That person is attractive!" Is trying to find the personality that the attraction is conveying. I think even dumb, young thirsty dudes pull this with thing like "big tiddy goth gf" meming. Yeah they're shallow but they still have like weird tells that they have hopes for their partner and want guidance in courting styles. People want another person, not just a high genetic dice roll.
We want those extra details before we make hard calls on attraction.
Agreed that these dudes belong in their own “psyop/propped up by God knows who” entity.
Would also be interested to see where you’d place Henry Cavill. I would imagine handsome, but he’s a top topic amongst the conservative/Evie types.
I had to Google Henry Cavill. That man is an instant Gorgeous.
What?? A potato?? He has lots of interesting angles to his face, he's not potato like at all. He basically looks like a Roman statue, except one that got punched in the nose so it's a little smashed. But also he's hot because he appears to be very tall...which is weird bc I guess he isn't, but he looks like he is. And he always plays roles that are simultaneously tough warrior guys but also very protective and passionate and not afraid of his feminine side. Like every single role he plays he's a killer who spends his life adoring and protecting women and children and standing up for them against asshole men. Of course women love him. If he'd played different roles, maybe not so much.
It's funny that he looks tall but isn't, because I thought the opposite about James Gandolfini when I watched The Sopranos. He looked so much shorter than he really was. I wonder what does that
Good question! I would really like to know the answer. Maybe it's like head size in proportion to body? Or something about limb length? Bc Gandolfini has a giant head. I assumed Pedro was like 6'4" but I just looked it up and he's 5'11". Which isn't short obviously, and probably is quite tall for an actor, but on screen he comes off as towering over everyone and very tall.
I guess it's natural to take potato to mean rounded and blobby; they are. I mostly mean bland in a way that's warming and yummy. Non-threatening and non-descript in a good way. We're talking looks so I shouldn't invoke meals. .. Pedro's always looked a bit basset houndy to me so I can't help but invoke droop though, so I'm sure that's part of it.
Funny he looks very average in height to me. But averageness is like his impact on me hard. He looks like a super nice guy though, but broey not swishy. I chalk it to DILF thirst for a reason because he does look like he was born with kids and advice on how to fix a lawn-mower.
This is totally bizarre I cAnnot understand this. And he doesn't have any children even though he's about to be 50. 😂 The only way that I can think this makes any sense at all is because you associate him with the Mandalorian, which was basically a kid's show?? But he was in a mask the whole thing so that doesn't make sense. I don't see any lawnmower fixing or dad energy at all, I see swashbuckling latin lover/protector. To me he's like updated Antonio Banderas. But I guess I associate him much more strongly with Oberyn Martell.
Also, you're too tall to have opinions on height. 😊 Once you hit 6'3" you guys just think everyone is short unless they're like basketball players.
I never get Pedro Pascal thirst myself.
I'm not saying he does anything wrong, but he strikes me like an approachably Latin potato, and it's kind of uncanny when the cinematography is presenting him as hot. I guess, I get the idea of positive masculinity since he comes across like a guidance counselor who used to drive a truck or a forklift for a living-- just odd for that to evidently be such a skirt dropper.
I mostly write it off as severe DILF lust. I like him but I kinda wish I saw him in less (or at least different) stuff because I find him about as intimidating as wool socks straight out of the dryer.
I don't see Walter Matthau, Steve Buscemi, John Goodman, Danny DeVito or Peter Lorre.
What are you even doing? Why aren't they on your stud list?
I have always perceived another category, not represented here, which I would describe as Beautiful. Dennis Hopper, Terence Stamp, Eric Roberts, Cillian Murphy. Sometimes brutish (autocorrected to British, haha) and superficially ugly, but with delicate facial features: eyes, eyebrows, lips. Almost androgynous, as though the zygote could have gone either way and produced a stunning specimen of either sex. The corresponding female category is Handsome, e.g. Anjelica Huston, Angela Bassett, Michelle Yeoh.
Oh, I appreciate those categories!
Cillian Murphy is the male Anya Taylor Joy.